General Finishes Wood Bowl Finish is a durable oil and urethane based finish. In French polishing, a drying oil like linseed is used to pop the shimmer/chatoyance and figure in the wood before the shellac is applied. I'd never use a water based product on furniture. Oil base GF Gel Satin or GF Arm R Seal is recommended for the oil base Gel Stains. With polyester's rigidity, I'm worried the wood movement will crack the stiff polyester. For especially tough knots use multiple coats of amber shellac. I'd like to use a water-based polyurethane over a staircase I stained last night with a Sherwin Williams oil-based stain to avoid yellowing. Created from the dried secretions of the Lac beetle, this natural product is … Oil-based finishes amber over time; do not use them over white or very light colors. (I'm not sure whether that wide compatibility also includes lacquer and catalysed finishes.) ... Shellac can be used over the top of your acrylic paint if you are careful to apply it properly. Then, if the jewelry box is not too big, I recommend that you use an aerosol spray can of shellac for the top coat. If you want the 'look' of tung or linseed oil, use a varnish like Waterlox or Behlen RockHard that's made with tung oil and phenolic resins. I'd like to create a darker overtone. http://www.ridgidforum.com/forum/sho...45&postcount=1, https://www.youtube.com/user/PowerToolInstitute, https://www.youtube.com/channel/UC1p...qcZKHyrqKhikFA, If this is your first visit, be sure to This can also be used to speed up the process because the shellac can go directly onto oiled wood without waiting for the oil to dry. Also I always apply stain and varnish separately and never use a combined … So there’s no need to go oil on oil simply because your stain is oil-based. I wouldn't. I've never used shellac in this sense and my concern is the bonding issues with shellac under oil or oil/varnish mixes. Best temperature for application: between 40f and 90f (4c and 32c) It cannot be used over other finishes, or over oil-base stains or many fillers; the solvents in lacquer will dissolve other finishes and incompatible stains and fillers. What is Shellac? amber shellac will seal them off so they can't bleed into the finish coat to ruin it. Re: Shellac over oil-based stain? Well worth the trip to your local library or bookstore. Shellac-Based. You can apply to raw wood, or you can apply it over an existing finish. Thanks guys... both for the advice and the welcome. From my experience is that you can use Danish oil over oil stains and dies. ... Shellac can be used over any stain except alcohol-base types and over any filler. This page was generated at 06:46 AM. From contributor K: The stain was color matched to our new hickory floors, which are stained a medium-dark true brown (no yellow). ... and inferior looking finish. (Finishing Forum) It also can go over oil-based finishes and can be applied using synthetic-bristle brushes, a foam roller or a rag, as can other water-based polyurethanes. And actually, the answer is YES—you can use our EMTECH water-based sealer or top coat over the oil stain. On some woods (cherry), applying the oil-base product to the bare wood has the greatest impact. The differences between the squares are subtle. Bob D. 2006. For really glossy surfaces like laminate IKEA cabinets, the adhesion is not as strong as shellac primer. From Paul Snyder, forum technical advisor: You can apply oil-base varnish (non-poly) over shellac without any problem. Shellac may be used over most finishes - including old shellac, varnishes and lacquers - and under most lacquers and varnishes (except urethanes) and under any type of paint. The shellac piece really pops the grain. I wait a minimum of 10 hours before applying the shellac after staining. Depending on how new the wood is, one or two coats of 3-lb. However, I am not a fan of this method for a number of reasons. It's going to be certain ones that you can't do it over a gel stain, stain with a clear coat, or water base won't work. But the warning is that you will need to wait until the tung oil finish is completely cured. then a drying oil or an oil/varnish blend is a good choice. Shellac has wide compatibility. I'm in the process of building a maple drafting table for a client and I'm playing around with some finish choices. "It's a table saw, do you know where your fingers are?" Linseed-oil based stain is perhaps the classic variety of stain. How light is a light sanding? We used Zinsser Cover Stain oil based primer. Drying oils like linseed and tung are a lot less durable than varnish and are not film forming finishes. Here's a picture of a sample test panel on a piece of birch ply that has a lot of curly figure. Get shopping advice from experts, friends and the community! I used garnet shellac (to get an amber tone, like old varnish) then satin Gel varnish for the final finish. Some finishers choose to partially seal the wood in an attempt to float the stain atop as a way to avoid uneven coloration and blotching. It dries to an amber color with a gloss finish. Water base GF En- duro-Var, High Performance or … Can a water base stain varnish go over a previously coated oil based stain varnish? Dewaxed shellac is unusual in being compatible with both water- and oil-based finishes, and in fact is sometimes used as an "adapter" layer between those. Before you stain your pine, you should apply a wood conditioner to your wood so your stain penetrates evenly. The beauty of all our water-based sealers and topcoats is that they’ll level and adhere to whatever solvent- or oil-based stain you’ve used. It can go over, or under, either. Add a small amount of lubricant, such as mineral oil, on the pad before application. Durability wise, this formulation is better than an alkyd varnish but not quite as tough as a uralkyd varnish (polyurethane). Other woods, like cherry, tend to blotch under oil-based stains. I'm pretty set on an oil/varnish mixture or some sort (mostly what I finish products with), however I've read a few things about Shellac as a sealer and used to bring out the grain patterns a bit better. Bob D has already mentioned that shellac works fine over Minwax, and I also have that experience. Shellac is a good choice over linseed oil because it will adhere well even if the oil isn't fully cured. All times are GMT-5. It is for interior use only and requires 3 coats for maximum durability. Fully cures in about 1 week so be careful for the first week. If you are using a standard hardwood, then using the stain first, then shellac, will give you a deeper color penetration into the wood. You don't want to apply a harder finish (varnish) over a softer finish (oil/varnish blend). Woodworking Myth: You should never put a water-based finish on top of an oil-based finish. check out the. Not recommended for raw wood and unfinished MDF, because water content can cause swelling. My only concern with this is that my table top is two feet of solid maple. Shellac is unmatched in its adhesion to just about any material that needs finishing or painting. Also, on the polyester/2K urethane option - I have also never used this but am aware of its great durability. Zinser Shellac (regular and dewaxed) is a great barrier coat. ... "What finish is best for over the oil base Gel Stains? It produces the exact look I was looking for, however … My only comment to add is, with Minwax, I always let oil based stain dry for a day, then wipe it down with terry cloth moistened lightly with paint thinner, then let it dry for another couple days before applying top coat. Oil based primer. "?ǝɹɐ sɹǝƃuıɟ ɹnoʎ ǝɹǝɥʍ ʍouʞ noʎ op `ʍɐs ǝlqɐʇ ɐ s,ʇı". (*When working over an existing finish or painting on the stain ... Gel Stain over raw wood: Dry Times: … In the 1920s shellac was replaced in factories by lacquer for two primary reasons: shellac resin (from bug secretions) is a commodity product that was going up in price as demand increased, while lacquer was going down in price; and lacquer thinner (a blend of solvents) makes lacquer much mor… Some varnishes are lighter in color than others because of the drying oil that's used to make them (e.g., soya oil). Enduro-Var cannot be used with any oil-based product, sanding sealer or shellac. It does have to be dewaxed if you plan to use waterborne paint. October 13, 2008, KnowledgeBase: Finishing: General Wood Finishing. If you do not desire the amber, and with java I don't see why you would, then you could head straight into the final topcoats. Interestingly, though, on the other hand, you can’t use oil-based paints over latex paint.. FWIW, PK is the hands down resident expert when it comes to "years ago". Water-based oil-modified polyurethane is a relatively new product that combines the durability of an oil base with the cleanup of a water base. The stain goes on as a liquid, the solvent evaporates, and the stain dries. If you want to take an extra precaution you can use shellac as an intermediate coat. If you plan to use oil-base poly, it's best to use dewaxed shellac to improve adhesion with the poly. When you want a "close to the wood" natural finish without a lot of protection from wear, heat, water, etc. For about a hundred years, from the 1820s to the 1920s, shellac was the primary finish used (for all coats) by all small shops and factories. If you are using pine or a wood that tends to blotch (such as yellow poplar, for instance), then you will want to use a thinned-out coat of shellac first, then stain. Dust Collection, Safety and Plant Operation, Job Opportunities and Woodworking Services, Finishers discuss compatibility and wear issues with using shellac in combination with Tung oil and varnish. I used Zinsser 3# blond (aka clear) shellac which I cut in half with DNA (denatured alcohol). By adding oil to varnish you only reduce its durability. If so How long do I need to leave the oil based to cure? You can use one coat to seal the wood. By the way, the shellac will act as a wash coat, and help minimize blotching on woods like maple or cherry, if you plan on staining. 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